(Photo: Neda Navaee)<\/p>\n\n\n\n
10th May 2026<\/p>\n\n\n\n
Tania Mazzetti is the Principal Second Violin of the London Philharmonic Orchestra \u2013 she joined the orchestra from Italy in 2016 as Sub-Principal, becoming Principal in 2018. Tania is also a conductor, and part of the 2026-27 programme of the Royal Philharmonic Society for Conductors. She recently founded the Bermondsey Chamber Orchestra in London.<\/p>\n\n\n\n
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I\u2019m so glad you agreed to speak with me today, Tania. Your role is one I\u2019m very interested in. I know you\u2019ve also been a concertmaster so are experienced as a first and<\/em> second violinist. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n I am. Well, I think it\u2019s fair to say, with some exceptions, that I mostly played first violin until I got this job and moved to London. I worked a couple of times as Guest Principal Second but yes, I worked as concertmaster in Sardinia, Italy before I moved here and when I was freelancing I mostly played first violin. Actually, I really enjoy the change! <\/p>\n\n\n\n I can imagine that, actually. Do you find the role very different?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n It is<\/em> a very different role in the orchestra, but I think it suits me\u2026 at least I hope so! (Laughs) I really like to be in the middle of the engine, where the machine moves and gets going \u2013 you are in the thick of the action in a lot of different ways. It is true that from a purely technical, virtuoso point of view it\u2019s often an easier part, which gives me the time to listen more, enjoy more, and do other things like drive, pull or resist. My mind is more available to consider places to go from there. <\/p>\n\n\n\n However, if you listen to a piece that is quite dense in texture it\u2019s harder to follow the second violin part. It\u2019s not as automatically recognisable to the ear as the first violin part, meaning that in some ways it\u2019s easier to lose where you are in reference to other people. So it\u2019s trickier in that respect. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Your comment about being in the \u2018engine\u2019 of the orchestra reminds me of something that Scott Dickinson (Principal Viola of the Philharmonia) said. He said that he loves the viola\u2019s \u2018under the bonnet sound\u2019. [1]<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Exactly, we\u2019re in the belly of the orchestra. There\u2019s a lot that happens there in terms of making the sound, but also in terms of driving or resisting. The second violins are a little engine force \u2013 we have movement, which is a very exciting place to be. There are different challenges: as I said there are fewer virtuoso technicalities, but the tessitura in our parts compared to the first violins\u2019 is often trickier. It\u2019s in the middle range, so when we do have a main line and we need to project it, it\u2019s often an octave lower and needs to have a different body and sound. The first violins will often be given an amazing line, then suddenly we have one in the middle register and it doesn\u2019t come out, so people think the second violins have no sound! (laughs) But it\u2019s often because of the way the music was written. So there are slightly different things that we need to pay attention to.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Right. Scott also said that you\u2019re playing the \u2018most pungent aromatic aspects for the music\u2019, which is a lovely way to put it, I think. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Exactly. A lot of our harmonies are really beautiful, so you can really bring out the colour, or the \u2018taste\u2019 and \u2018spice\u2019 of the music.<\/p>\n\n\n\n The conductor Peter Stark told me that he actually preferred <\/em>playing in the second violins than the firsts because it is more musically interesting. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes, I know Peter. He was a fellow Principal Second Violin! Yes, I think it suits me better too because I love the orchestra as a big animal, and I have more availability to be with all the other voices and take them in. I\u2019m in the middle of everything, and that\u2019s something that I personally really enjoy. It also depends a little bit on the composer \u2013 there are some that write incredible parts for second violins. For example, Mahler writes completely independent parts for us \u2013 there are so many examples \u2013 his Symphony No. 9 of course, and No. 5. But there are so many, we\u2019re given amazing<\/em> lines. <\/p>\n\n\n\n Beethoven also writes beautifully for the second violins \u2013 we\u2019re given a lot of accompaniment but it\u2019s always incredible, it\u2019s never boring. You can bring out so many aspects of the rhythm, energy and harmony. Of course, if you go to some bel canto Italian operas the second violin part can be quite repetitive and boring, but that\u2019s also a challenge, to find in those parts the interesting harmonies and support the line in a musical way.<\/p>\n\n\n\n What do you sometimes wish some conductors understood about being a second violinist? <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, occasionally conductors pay particular attention to the singing line (and of course, there are some amazing conductors who do some fantastic work with that) and then the bass line because that\u2019s so fundamental in terms of harmony. But that means that the middle voices could get a little bit neglected. <\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s a shame because a lot happens there and it\u2019s where you can really sculpt the music. I think of the singing line as being way more \u2018painted\u2019 \u2013 you can paint a line, have an amazing colour and phrasing but it is more two-dimensional. But where you can really work with the materic element is with the middle voice and basses. We can shape the music in a different way. We give the third dimension: the texture underneath and the layers of rhythm, harmony and counterpoint. <\/p>\n\n\n\n I see \u2013 the three-dimensional aspect is what you provide and that can be \u2018sculpted\u2019 more. I like that analogy, that\u2019s a new one for me, I\u2019m going to think about that\u2026<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Kristina Blaumane, your Principal Cello [2] spoke to me in more detail about the LPO\u2019s hierarchy (and in orchestras generally). It\u2019s quite fixed and ordered in comparison to many other fields. Very often if you get promoted it is into another orchestra, it\u2019s not as likely to be within the LPO. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, I am one of the exceptions. I was Sub<\/em>-Principal first!<\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, absolutely! How about going from seconds to firsts? Do the violinists do that very much?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n I don\u2019t think it happens that much. People tend to apply for the job they think suits them, and I also think that once you get a tutti job, most players wouldn\u2019t want to go through it all again to get another tutti job. It could<\/em> happen because a player might get bored and want a change of scenery, but I can\u2019t actually think of any <\/em>examples at the moment. It\u2019s more usual for people to go for a numbered position (in the first or second violin section) and try to move up hierarchically. It\u2019s different from one orchestra to another, but in the LPO we have six first violin numbered positions and four second violin numbered positions. After that it\u2019s rank and file. <\/p>\n\n\n\n Moving into a numbered position means that you get to sit at the front more regularly \u2013 there is a sitting up policy. So, if you are No. 3 and No. 2 is not there you get to sit in No. 2\u2019s position. So people do go from rank and file to the numbered positions quite a lot. But horizontally from second to first violins? Not much I believe. <\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s interesting because that there are so many cogs in the orchestral machine and yet it\u2019s such a different experience for each of those cogs. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Oh it is, yes. It\u2019s very different. To be honest with you, playing at the back of the second violin section is really difficult. There\u2019s less responsibility, but for me it\u2019s way harder! At the front you need to be really sure, really secure and you need to just go for it and make the decisions. But you can hear so much better, you\u2019re very close to the conductor, and you\u2019re also very close to the Principals of the other sections. Everything is more chamber-like, so in a way it\u2019s easier than being at the back where you often hear more from the winds than the front of your own section. You have to rely a lot more on your eyes and just look at the front \u2013 it\u2019s a very different experience. <\/p>\n\n\n\n I suppose I\u2019m also just used to being at the front \u2013 that\u2019s where you need to give security and leadership, which is a very precise skill. The orchestra needs players with all different types of strengths. Maybe some people are not that good at the leadership part of it or taking responsibility, but to me it comes very easily and naturally \u2013 I don\u2019t really think about it. A lot of conductors, rightfully so, want the sound right from the back of the section \u2013 you can\u2019t have the sound thinning out, but being at the back is really hard \u2013 you need to know when you can really go for it. You need to have courage at the back because you\u2019re far away and you have to trust what you see.<\/p>\n\n\n\n When I spoke to Emer McDonough, Principal Flute of the RPO, [3] she commented on how most of the players get very used to the specific places in which they sit. Even though they perform in many different venues, if their place on the stage is changed (for example, for a smaller Classical, or chamber piece) they\u2019re all suddenly disconcerted! <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, seconds violins do move! <\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, this is what I was going to say! Sometimes you\u2019re opposite the firsts.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes. That depends on the repertoire, or the conductor, or both.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So talk me through that a little bit. What repertoire do you mainly change around for?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Generally we tend to play that way more with Classical repertoire. Having said that, some conductors arrange us that way for Brahms and Mahler, which makes sense because of the independent lines we referred to before. Whereas if you go towards something like Stravinsky, or even Tchaikovsky, we often play next to each other because the two lines are much more interdependent.<\/p>\n\n\n\n How do you find that?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Again, it\u2019s a very different experience for the players at the front to those at the back, but as a general rule I think playing next to the firsts is easier for everyone, especially when our line is related to, or the same as the firsts. Of course, you always have to refer to the leader, and proximity helps to see and hear better. It\u2019s definitely easier for the back of the section, because they\u2019re closer to the back of the first violins, so the two groups can obviously rely on each other\u2019s playing. <\/p>\n\n\n\n I actually really enjoy playing opposite the firsts, but I know I am weird like that! That\u2019s not normal \u2013 no one enjoys it. Playing opposite gives a lot of independence, which I love, we really get to be a different group, and the antiphonal effect can be so good. But it\u2019s way harder because we have to turn our back to the audience, so our sound projection needs to be enhanced. The back of the section needs to rely on other players, not the first violins \u2013 so either the bassists, or whoever else is next to or near them. <\/p>\n\n\n\n The back of the firsts and back of the seconds is on opposite sides of the stage, so it requires a lot of work from everyone, and me, to help facilitate that. On top of that, if we\u2019re playing a piano concerto, there will be a piano in the middle of us all, so you really have to work with your eyes only! There\u2019s a little bit of a guesswork involved, but I like it and as a bonus I get to see the whole orchestra, which I love. I can enjoy everyone\u2019s playing. Also if I have a delicate part to play that goes together with a wind entry, I can see them breathe which is very helpful. <\/p>\n\n\n\n Oh yes, of course. Normally, you can\u2019t see the woodwinds at all. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n No, but you sort of feel<\/em> it. There is a sort of action-reaction in music where one gesture produces another. Most of the time that is enough to know where to play \u2013 there is a collective reaction to the gesture. I find that one of the most fascinating things in music and in the orchestra: how do 80 players, or 50 strings, know that they need to play together in that moment? It\u2019s the same when you throw a ball and you can see where it\u2019s going to land. But it\u2019s fascinating because this involves sound \u2013 it\u2019s not visual. <\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s incredible, it\u2019s like you\u2019re \u2018catching\u2019 the sound together. Do you have a theory about how that works or is it something that you\u2019re a bit mystified by? <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019m not sure it\u2019s mystical \u2013 I think that it works in the same way as it does visually. I think the ball is a good analogy, as if you throw it, but with your ears. If we have five concerts with the same piece, every night is going to be different, so it\u2019s not that you know after half a second the other note comes\u2026 we know when the other note comes, it depends on how the previous line is going, you follow the trajectory with your ears. Of course, you have a conductor in front of you, but most of the time the conductor is leading the musical gestures \u2013 the responsibility of placing the sound at the exact same time is on the players.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So do you think that most<\/em> second violinists find playing opposite the firsts much more difficult? <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, I don\u2019t want to assume, but I know that it\u2019s hard at the back \u2013 that I can tell you! How happy you are about it seems to depend on where you\u2019re sitting. I get the nicest end of it, I think, because although it\u2019s harder, I\u2019m still in a kind of double quartet setting. So I can see more of the orchestra, and I can liaise, but there are moments when it\u2019s harder because we are simply further away from the firsts. So some things that we would usually adjust naturally require more attention. <\/p>\n\n\n\n You\u2019re also a conductor, of the Bermondsey Chamber Orchestra\u2026<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n You know everything! That\u2019s right. I founded the ensemble about a year ago, shortly after I started training as a conductor. I have been so lucky to have a group of colleagues and friends who really support me in this new journey.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s fantastic. What do you think are the advantages of being a string-playing conductor? <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, what a string player knows instinctively is the feeling of the resistance of the sound. The sense of sustenuto, of physical resistance between the bow and the string, is something that is quite difficult and important to recreate as a conductor. That\u2019s the lesson that I bring with me, and it\u2019s very helpful to have that experience. But actually, while I do my score studies I pay a lot of attention to the winds. I feel like I know much more about the strings so I concentrate more on making sure I breathe with the winds in the right way.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You\u2019ve now been in the LPO for ten years. Of all the conductors you have worked with, do you find it\u2019s easier to be conducted by a former string player?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n I honestly don\u2019t think it depends on that. Of course, you can find conductors that were string players, violinists, for instance, who work in more detail with string players. Perhaps they\u2019ll get more into bowings or ask for more technical details (like which string to play on or what fingering to use) or they will just clearly know more about what we do. It\u2019s particularly about bowings \u2013 that\u2019s a tricky territory if you\u2019re not a string player. But I don\u2019t think, from our side, that it\u2019s better or worse, it doesn\u2019t depend on that. When I don\u2019t know, I often try to guess what the conductor was as a player. I think the one thing that does make a difference (although there are so many exceptions) is that you can see when a conductor has been in an orchestra, or played an orchestral instrument rather than a keyboard instrument. But that doesn\u2019t mean that there aren\u2019t loads of amazing conductors that are pianists. <\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019ve asked that question a small number of times to Principal players. Andy Barclay (Principal Percussion of the LPO)[4] didn\u2019t seem to think it made any difference, he felt exactly the same way as you. But LSO\u2019s Principal Horn, Diego Incertis,[5] said that Esa Pekka Salonen stood out for him, as he was also a horn player.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n I completely understand that. But the horn is a particularly tricky and unforgiving instrument. When I conduct, I think that if the horns play a split note there\u2019s a very high chance that it\u2019s my fault. If the upbeat is late then there isn\u2019t enough time for breathing, so as a conductor I really try to pay attention to that. Us violinists don\u2019t need as much breathing\/upbeat\/preparation time as wind players do. We do still need an upbeat, but technically we can just put the bow down and play. It affects them far more if a conductor doesn\u2019t breathe with them \u2013 it makes it very difficult to play.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s interesting, and I suppose a lot of people who haven\u2019t played a brass instrument just don\u2019t appreciate how physically exhausting it is in comparison to most of the other instruments. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes. I\u2019ve always been very curious \u2013 ever since I was quite young I used to go around a lot and ask questions about different instruments!<\/p>\n\n\n\n There is one last question I\u2019d love to ask, about a topic that has come up a few times recently (from the Philharmonia players in particular). It\u2019s about how different orchestras have their own \u2018sound\u2019 or \u2018DNA\u2019. Both Robin O\u2019Neill and Scott Dickinson (who featured in the last issue) have played with other London orchestras, and they commented on how, even when the players change, they still retain their character. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n What\u2019s your experience of that phenomenon? <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n It is definitely true. It is so <\/em>true, and the most incredible thing is its persistence, as you were saying. Since I joined the LPO ten years ago (in 2016) a lot of players have changed. And yet I don\u2019t think the sound has really changed \u2013 there\u2019s a culture that gets passed down somehow. I know the feeling because I stepped into it myself, and I came from abroad, which is probably an even bigger change than moving from one London orchestra to another. <\/p>\n\n\n\n First of all, I think it either works for you or it doesn\u2019t, and that also applies to different London orchestras with their different personalities and sound characteristics. Of course, I also really enjoy playing with the other orchestras, but you completely sink into what\u2019s around you and embrace it extremely quickly! I think that\u2019s probably because of the recruitment system in this country: through trials people really get to select the players that do <\/em>fit into that. So it\u2019s a two-way thing. People adapt, but also the orchestra recruits people that suit it. It\u2019s incredible. Of course, the LPO recruits from all over the world (America, Australia\u2026) but it\u2019s not about that \u2013 it\u2019s about belonging, and embracing that way of playing.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s very interesting. I suppose because you\u2019re so tightly synchronised with each other it almost has<\/em> to be that way. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes, but then you\u2019d think all orchestras would sound the same if you go to a very high level and they don\u2019t. They really don\u2019t. I think the most incredible thing is when people manage to fit into that culture and still bring their own very distinctive personality, especially Principal players. I\u2019m a strong believer in players being able to do that. I don\u2019t teach much, but it\u2019s happened many times that young players ask me what I think they should do for trials. My answer is, \u2018you should do you\u2019. It\u2019s not only about the orchestra choosing you \u2013 it\u2019s also about you fitting in well. You have to like it and it needs to suit you \u2013 you can\u2019t force yourself into being someone you aren\u2019t. There may be other groups with completely different personalities or types of sound where you might fit in better. <\/p>\n\n\n\n The amazing thing about the orchestra is that it is one big organism that is somehow perfectly synchronised and hierarchically organised (horizontally and vertically). Yet this perfectly attuned ensemble is also made up of incredible individual musicians. <\/p>\n\n\n\n Absolutely. I mean, even two of the conductors the LPO are most familiar with \u2013 Vladimir Jurowksi and Robin Ticciati \u2013 are so, so different. That influences the sound, too.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n It does. It does a lot. Actually, you picked two examples that I think are very telling. Those two conductors have a particular capacity and amazing ability of making the orchestra sound a certain way. So, if Vladimir is conducting us it becomes for me, quite unmistakably, \u2018LPO with Vladimir Jurowski\u2019 \u2013 an incredibly specific sound, perfectly tight and sculpted. Robin does the same, but in a completely different way, finding a very unique breathing sound. <\/p>\n\n\n\n And yet in both cases it\u2019s still the LPO sound, with all the history behind it, because (and I quote a colleague) \u2018we sit on the shoulders of giants\u2019. There is so much history going back. I\u2019ll hear many historical recordings and just shiver thinking, \u2018that\u2019s us!\u2019 Obviously, I\u2019m not there myself, but it\u2019s the LPO. So you can use that incredible specificity and unity to create something even more unique and special. It\u2019s quite wonderful to witness, and to be part of. Now Vladimir comes much less, of course \u2013 he comes twice a year, but when he does it probably takes about half a rehearsal, and we revert exactly to that specific sound that he created over the years with us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Fascinating. I just wonder how someone would study that, psychologically\u2026 <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s been said to me many times that conducting is just as much (if not more) about psychology and dealing with people as the music. I hear comments about \u2018blending the egos\u2019 etc. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Right, that sounds like a conductor\u2019s reply! What I actually think is that one needs to learn to use the egos, because ego can be a potent, powerful tool. There is no true musician without ego, at least to an extent, and in a positive way that means creativity, artistry, personality.Blend is very important but personality is equally so. And I think there is way of balancing the egos but also using them \u2013 you need that in a performance in order to make it truly unique. A good orchestra quite naturally blends, even more a top orchestra like the LPO. For example, I think our orchestra has the most amazing blend in the woodwinds, it\u2019s just so beautiful. But that doesn\u2019t mean there are not personalities that have a good degree of ego (again, in the positive sense of the term!). If you step on a stage you need to bring that you, as long as it serves the music and not vice versa. <\/p>\n\n\n\n Right, it\u2019s not a bad thing. I once said jokingly in an interview with Robyn Bollinger, Concertmaster of the Detroit Symphony Orchestra,[6] that I presumed she didn\u2019t like to work with conductors who have a big ego. She answered, <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n \u2018Actually, an ego is OK. There are things that go along with having a big ego that enable one to be up on that podium. It\u2019s hard to stand up in front of a hundred people and be authentically yourself \u2013 you have to be really sure that you belong there. I think if you don\u2019t have any ego, you can\u2019t really do the job. But it can\u2019t all<\/em> be about the conductor.\u2019<\/strong> <\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes. An ego is totally fine if it\u2019s there to serve the music \u2013 in fact, you need one. The problem only comes if it overrides the performance and becomes more about the person and less about the music. We all need an ego because we need a vision and clarity of musical thought. This is especially so for a conductor, but also for the Leader, Principals\u2026 actually for all musicians.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Anyway, I\u2019ve kept you long enough. This has been brilliant, thank you so much. You\u2019ve given me lots of food for thought, which I knew would be the case. <\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n Thank you, it\u2019s been fun! I\u2019m glad you\u2019re happy with it. <\/p>\n\n\n\n —<\/p>\n\n\n\n 1<\/sup><\/strong> Click here<\/a> to read the full interview with Scott Dickinson.<\/p>\n\n\n\n 2<\/sup><\/strong> Click here<\/a> to read the full interview with Kristina Blaumane.\u00a0<\/p>\n\n\n\n 3<\/sup><\/strong> Click here<\/a> to read the full interview with Emer McDonough.<\/p>\n\n\n\n 4<\/sup><\/strong> Click here<\/a> to read the full interview with Andy Barclay.<\/p>\n\n\n\n 5<\/sup><\/strong> Click here<\/a> to read the full interview with Diego Incertis.<\/p>\n\n\n\n